Editors Note: Our European contributor, “c_g”, has checked in with the first in a series on the Rohloff 14 speed internally geared hub.
By “c_g”:
Part 1 – INTRO: Who of you has heard about the Rohloff Speedhub 500/14? For those of you who have – it probably holds the image of German engineering par excellence – and of high pricing probably.
For those of you who haven’t I will give you a very brief wrap-up of the thing:
The Speedhub is an all German made, internally geared hub with 14 gears spaced evenly at 13.6 % resulting in exactly the same range as a standard MTB 27-speed drive train. By following extremely low tolerances and keeping the system completely encapsulated Rohloff claims to have comparable power loss by friction to an externally geared system (aka derailleur driven) and will run virtually forever with minimal servicing (only an annual oil change recommended). The hub has been in production for over 10 years And yes, it is costly, even here in its homeland.
(Before you readers start raining a myriad of technical questions, I herewith redirect your enquiries of such kind to the Rohloff website: www.rohloff.de. There is tons of technical info to be read about the working, on Rohloff´s – including compatibility charts, gearing ratios, exploded drawings. They even have done a book covering the Rohloff story)
fig. 1 The ROHLOFF Speedhub 500/14 in the test – condition like it should be: spotted with dirt. The labeling is laser etched into the black anodized hub shell. Each hub is individually numbered.
What motivated Bernd Rohloff, the man behind the hub to build this? – Before the Speedhub Rohloff has been producing (and still is for that matter) premium bicycle chains including several precision tools in that area.
There is a neat anecdote about it (rephrased to keep it short): “He was doing a vacation on the French Atlantic coast, riding along the sandy beach … or at least trying to as it only took two breakers to completely foul the drive train. It was there and then that the idea for a ever-running system was born. Two years and countless hours with technical drawings and engineering later, Bernd was pedaling it away happily without a second thought to the drive train-hostile environment. That was 1998 and by now there are over 100.000 Speedhub units in use on all kinds of bikes.
Here comes a bit more tech talk though:
The Rohloff 500/14 Speedhub basically consists of three units:
1, The 14-speed internal geared hub (available in a disc- or v-brake specific, and a QR or through axle version). Consisting of a hugely oversized hub shell housing the transmission unit (32 and 36 holes available in the colors silver, black and red anodized with laser etched logos), interchangeable side-plates on both sides and a screw on cog (standard is 16 teeth, 13, 15 and 17 teeth are available separately)
2, The mounting hardware: It takes special attachment systems to compensate the rotational forces induced by the internal gearing. Depending on the drop-out and frame design these can be simply a plate (if the frame is Rohloff-specific like in fig. 2), or varying torque arms (depending if the frame has disc brake bosses or not, one version shown in fig. 3)
fig. 2 This set up shows Rohloff specific dropouts, where the torque is taken up by the long slotted dropout and a special plate (only visible by the “in the know” near the lower end of the slot). Chain tensioning here is done by the sliding dropouts. The shifting commands are transferred by dual cables and the external gearbox.
fig. 3 Here a version with the long torque arm is shown. This version is needed when the frame is not suitable for disc brakes or when the disc brake tabs are not on the seat stays of the frame like on this frame. Why? -Think about which direction rotational forces will work.
3, The twist shifter proprietary to the system. This shifter is driving dual cables to the hub – usually in full length housing. The attachment to the hub can be by an external gearbox, like shown, which is recommended when running disc brakes or by an internal system which is about 100 g lighter. The shifter is not indexed like all other bike gearing systems but the indexing is happening directly at the place of shifting, inside the hub.
(Bikes with no built-in chain tensioning option or suspension bikes will need a chain tensioner) The rest of the modifications is like converting into a single chainring crankset and a specific 4-bolt disc rotor, as the standard systems don´t work with 6-bolt rotors.
Fig. 4 The shifters are like any twist shifter – only these actuate two cables. Yes, they are a bit clumsy looking.
So much for the marketing talk.
What is the Speedhub really all about? Does it work fine? How does the planetary gearing react when put through its paces? What about the total weight or weight distribution on the bike, compared to a standard derailleur system or SS? Is the system really bomb-proof and maintenance free – regardless of riding and climate?
And most important to many reading this site: How does it work when used in a 29er set-up?
I will see into all these matters in the course of this Rohloff specific series. Wait for more to come.
Ps: … and if you want specific info, let me know – I will see to incorporate them in the course of the review.
Look for further updates from “c_g” in the near future!
It’s a masterpiece
It’s expensive – isn’t it about $1K in the US?
No thanks.
Question:
Some of the more popular sited negatives of the Speed hub is the cost and weight distribution. But my question is how easily is it to get this beast worked on? I understand that break downs are supposed to be very rare, but if a rider was to have a problem, how many shops around the U.S. are able to do more than change the gear oil. Another question is: Does all internal repairs need to be completed at the factory in Germany?
Thanks
Shimano just announced their new hub internal geared hub recently.
http://thelazyrando.wordpress.com/2010/02/02/11-speed-shimano-alfine/
Wird one this they should be great, it seems to be a toss up though depending on the hub you get about half the people I know with them swear by them and wouldn’t have anything else. Then I know the same number of people who’ve got rid after continous problems with them and numerous returns to Germany. I think there’s a big Rohloff syndrome thing going off as well a lot of people who buy them and aren’t keen are in denial it takes a big man to admit that the last $1,000 they’ve spent on bike bit has been well a bit disappointing really. I really need to gt a demo bike with one on to have a play…
I had a speedhub serviced recently, sent it to rohloff usa and they farmed it out to cyclemonkey.com who did a great job, fast turnaround. This was for an early speedhub that I got off ebay which had seal issues.
The hub will pay for itself if you ride it long enough. The cog/chain/chainring lasts much longer than those in a derailleur setup, and are cheaper to replace.
Since the shift indexing is internal it is not affected by weather, mud, and cable condition.
I still ride derailleur setups, they are cheaper, lighter, and more efficient when clean. The rohloff beats them hands down for forget-about-it reliability in all conditions.
CJ: Weight distibution definately can bean issue depending on the syle of riding you do. I am not too much of a jumper or love those major air-time sessions but whenever I was riding the Speedhgub I had been able to adapt my riding style to the slightly offset weight distribution on the bike. More on that later on.
Maintenance and servicability on the trail or by your local shop? How many times have you ruined a standard hub and fixed it on the trail? 😉 No seriously, I know of no single shop even here in Germany, that does have the ability and tools to do a full rebuild on the Speedhub but it sure doesn´t stop people from buying them. Many things are near fool proof with servicing the Speedhub but man, do keep your hands off the transmission – if you ever have looked at the thing outside the hub shell you know why.
…and yes there is a service in the US that can do most anything if ever there is a technical problem – take a look at the Roholoff web site.
Raouligan: You should really take a spin on a Speedhub, so you don´t have to listen to rumors. But if you have so many friends actually riding a Speedhub this shouldn´t be a problem, right? Let us know what you think, will you?
Dman: In fact it is closer to $ 1.5 k.
c_g: Thanks for the reply. You make a good point about not exploding hubs on the trail. I have never exploded a hub…ever. But then again I only ride about 3000-4000 miles per year. Maybe this year I will hit 5000mi. I think an Internal Geared Hub (IGH) would be a good choice for me, but at 1.5K U.S. dollars. That is more than I have spent on any entire bike. If I had the disposable funds though, I would certainly consider the Rohloff.
I really appreciate you taking the time to author this series as I have always been interested in IGH(s) since the first time I ever read about them on the internet or saw 3 speed shimano hubs at a local shop.
On a side note I did see a rider in Lincoln last year at the Pirate Cycling League ride that had a Rohloff attached to a Niner. I think it was a Jet 9 to be exact. I didn’t get to talk with him much about the bike as he loading the bike up to head back home after finishing a 150 mile gravel ride. Seems to me that an IGH would excel in this type of riding situation.
Thanks again for answering my questions.
I always thought it would be cool to have one of those “in” the bottom bracket location (like that Honda Downhill bike that came out several years ago). That way, the weight would be centered in the bike. Even the cables would be shorter.
http://www.g-boxx.com/
Too bad these will never be lighter than derailleurs and cogs…
As i heard from friend of mine riding it the problem is that everything is Rohloff specific (chainring, disc rotor, oil?) that causes extra costs. Not in every country there is a Rohloff service so to fix a problem you have to send it to Germany. If you don’t have extra wheel you have to wait without a bike.
In tough conditions it rocks and I would go for it if money is no problem.
I keep an eye on what Shimano does with Alfine. They did 11geared 409% lately for just about 420$. Hope that they will get success with that and keep research so the price will go down. I think the future is 2 geard internal front derailleur and for example 11 geared rear hub (Sram XX is just 2×10).
Mickey: Rohloff specific chainrings? If they made them, be sure they would be very good, but NO – when using a standard chain (like most of us do), can use any chainring, given that it has the right size 😉
The other stuff is true . it needs its specific disc rotors and freewheel (which by the way is made of stainless steel and reversible to give you double the mileage). On the other hand running a Speedhub will enable you to be running the same chainring and chain for much longer; and replacing torn derailleurs or worn out cassettes is a thing of the past.
There is always two sides to a coin 😉
I would like to see a 9 speed version that is smaller, lighter and less expensive.
My personal perception of the Rohloff hub, it’s of a usefull product, very expensive, but with a very low technical developement.
It’ more than 10 years and it seems the same thing as the first time I saw it, and it works and weights more or less the same, when in the last 10 years traditional transmission systems had a great amount of developement.
My only question is the hub gear ratio. Has it been adjusted to compensate for the 29″ wheel or is it the same ratios as they have always been? I don’t want to get into a long gear inches discussion, but the standard for 26″ wheels does not give you the same useable range as on 29″ wheels.
And how about trying it with one of the new cranks with two chainring? Since that apparently is the way cranks are going, it makes sense to determine the hub’s compatibility as that type of setup.
My only complaint is the very ugly torque arm setup. I’d think with the precision that goes into the hub, they’d be able to make a more attractive setup.
Looking forward to the extended test.
It’s hard to appreciate that it’s been over 10 years since the introduction of the Speedhub. There have been 120,000+ hubs produced in that time, and it’s rare I come across somebody online who has had problems requiring factory servicing. So despite the hub being “old technology,” its design has withstood the test of many seasons, many miles and many riders.
My original hub, which I purchased in 2001, continues to run strong with no service other than not-quite annual oil changes and infrequent cable and cog changes. Over those years, it has progressed through four bikes. Three of those I bought as complete bikes with mostly XT drivetrains, which I was able to auction off “as new,” helping to recoup my original purchase cost (~$640, due to a favorable US $ to New Zealand $ exchange rate).
Raouligan brought up the point in his comment #5 of those owners who “have to” like the Speedhub after dropping major coin on it. I sat on the fence a good 2-3 years before purchasing #1, and it took a couple of attempts at recabling it, plus a few hundred miles, to get it shifting right and hub running smooth. Since that first purchase, I bought a second one that came with my first 29er (a 2001 Van Dessel Buzz Bomb), followed by one for my wife — she’s been on a Speedhub now since 2003 — and recently, one for our mountain tandem (which isn’t yet, but hopefully soon will be, a 29er). So speaking for myself, either I really like these hubs, or I’ve got a case of super denial.
BTW, the other Speedhubs I’ve purchased have all been used to various degrees, all mostly older stock, one of which was underhandedly sold to me as broken — with a very attractive price — requiring two $1 springs from Rohloff to “repair.” These hubs get smoother with age, and with owners turning up claiming 100,000 miles on theirs, I’m not too hesitant about buying used. They don’t break.
Rohloff USA and more recently Cycle Monkey are both local to me. I’ve visited their respective shops and gotten to know the owners (Thomas and Neil) over the years. I’ve heard some service stories: a batch of hubs that went overboard in the English Channel with a bunch of Storck frames, which later turned up in the US with *gasp* salt water corrosion; an owner who “lubricated” his bearings with thread lock; a couple of cracked flanges which were clearly a Rohloff QC problem. But I’ve never seen Thomas or Neil with a bunch of hubs awaiting service. Mostly wheel builds and disc brake conversions (for those hubs originally pruchased without a disc-compatible flange; I, too, went through this process with the hub that came with my Buzz Bomb).
There have been some changes to the hub over 10 years: The disc brake compatibility wasn’t originally available. Double oil seals were replaced with better working, less-friction producing single seals. The original winter and summer weight oils were replaced with a single all-season oil. The shifting detent springs were re-spec’d for a lighter feel at the twist shifter. The Speedbone and later Cycle Monkey’s “Monkeybone” replaced the ugly torque arm on many frames with disc brake tabs. I wonder if there have been any internal changes, as the parts are manfactured in small batches and ideal for incremental revisions and improvements.
Built-up Speedhub weights have consistently been 600-700g over my mostly XT-based 27-speed derivetains. But weight can be shaved in the following areas: purpose-built singlespeed crankset; delete the chain tensioner (hardtail w/ EBB or sliders, or full suspension w/ BB-centric pivot ala LENZ, Haro -or- URTs); use rear rim brake (swaps out disc-brake compatible Speedhub shell & external shifter unit for lighter-weight direct cabling); frame with Speedhub-specific dropouts -or- unused disc brake tab to avoid using heavier torque arm or Speedbone anti-torque devices. Lighter weight rims can also be used with good reliability due to the Speedhub’s wide, symmetrical and tall flanges — the Speedhub is the only way we’re able to successfully run a 32-spoke wheel on our tandem without any problems. I’d want at least a 40-spoker back there with any other hub.
With respect to gearing, the oft-quoted “equivalent to a 27 speed drivetrain” is close to the truth. In fact, the Speedhub is missing a gear when compared to a 22/32/44 crank x 11-34 cassette. Here are a couple of sample ranges, in gear inches:
17.1 > 105.6 | 22/32/44 x 11-34
17.2 > 90.4 | Speedhub 38 x 16 (roughly equivalent to above, with a 13-34 cassette)
19.1 > 93.6 | 26/39 x 11-36 Sram XX drivetrain
15.4 > 80.9 | Speedhub 34 x 16, geared down 10% to account for 29″ wheels
That last one violates Rohloff’s minimum 2.4:1 gearing, but is run by many without trouble. Keeping in mind that this same 2.4:1 minimum applies to a pro tandem team, it’s easy to feel comfortable taking liberties with published gearing restrictions. If, in fact, you manage to overtorque the hub, there are a series of 9 nylon sheer pins that join the hub innards to the shell, which are designed to give way before any damage can be done to the expensive parts. The sheer pins are reportedly easy and inexpensive to replace, though I don’t first-hand of any incidences of these giving up the ghost. Personally, I’ve voilated this gearing rule with a 36×16 drivetrain (2.25:1) and my wife with a 34×16 (2.125:1); we run our tandem one step above minimum gearing.
I’m a gear hub addict, not just a Speedhub freak. I’ve got a Nexus 7 on my pavement pounder (rough and notchy), soon to be replaced with a Nuvinci CVT (big fat pig). I built a Sram Spectro 7 (ok, but doesn’t like to downshift under pressure) into my wife’s cruiser. My folder has a Sram iMotion 9 (much smoother and quieter than any of my Speedhubs). The Alfine (which I’ve neither used or owned) seems to be holding up well to off-road riding; the oil bath lubrication of the newly announced Alfine 11 causes me to think that Shimano is getting serious about this business. I’m excited about the prospect of the Alfine, but the Speedhub still maintains a considerable gearing advantage. With many pricepoints and many gearing ranges to choose from, there are more and more good excuses for those unfamiliar with IGHs to stray away from the long-in-tooth derailleur based drivetrain.
great input speedub.nate, thanks.
You have touche many points I will write about later
… kind of makes me wonder why I am even writing this review with such knowledgable postings 😉
I am looking forward to your in put on the other articles on this series.
Hey 29er friends,I am Dutch and can tell you that there are much more Rohloff hubs in bikes than there are 29ers in Holland en Belgium and its still growing.Before I felt im love with 29 I had a Idworx Mountainrohler a $ 5000 no worrybike without rearsusp.,discbrakes en just alloy,but with a Rohloff. the only problem you possible will have are the shiftingcables and somethimes the shifter it self.when mud is going into the spaces between can gives you shifting problems.It will not break directly but you bit by bit going tougher.When you make your first 500 miles you will feel some resistance and my buddies said when i was shifting in some gears there is the espressomachine !,because my hub sounds like that.After a while it will disapeare.And after those miles you have a very smooth gearbox and will defend it with your life!My buddies where sceptic but 3 of them also buyed one.And didnt understand why I sold my bike.I love my bike but miss my Rohloff very much and I will buy one this year Idworx does not build in 29 but uses long wheel base concentrated at the rear and Continental 2.4 tires.This combi makes almost the height of a 29 wheel.Why not a 29 frame?money!you know why! these days.What I wanted to tell is that in the combination I discribed above it works very well! if you want to see some press stuff go to the site http://www.idworx.nl.I think 29 and rohlof is a golden couple the traction with a 29er in technical climbs is very good but with a Rohloff you have constant power on your pedals(the chain haves direct contact with the rear ax, so it feels you drive a Hummer.Rohloff is testing his new hub and it will be much lighter and more for xc competition.By the way,DH is not a problem at all with the Rohloff..In Europe ceveral DHers are using it in competition and are very happy with it because chainsuck is history!
Rohloff aficionados, when I rode a rohloff – one that had perhaps only covered 1000km it felt like riding through that beach sand.
This horrid feel and the weight put me off.
You fellas say that it gets smoother. Does it end up feeling like a clean conventional drivetrain ultimately?
For me that was a deal breaker.
@ professed, I have one that’s particularly grindy / noisy / whirry, and it’s got more miles on it than the others. Sometimes I think the frame it’s mounted to amplifies the noise, but it’s undoubtedly the “roughest” of the four. My original hub — the one I purchased new — began life a little rough but quickly became quiet and smooth as it gained mileage and after its first oil change. The other two, both acquired used in varying degrees, are unremarkable.
So I’d say that while they do smooth out over time, they’ve each got their unique signature, and some are rougher than others.
I’m using “smooth” in a relative context, by the way: Speedhubs still have a detectable “edge” to them that isn’t present in a clean derailleur setup, and isn’t felt in my Sram i9. And some lower gears are noisier than others, which new users often hone in on during long leg-burning climbs.
My main worry when ordering my Thorn Nomad with a Rohloff, was the fact you were restricted to 32 spokes.
Thorn have remedied this problem with custom engineered flanges that take more spokes.
I got mine bullet proofed with 48 http://www.flickr.com/photos/jalicat/4335085868/
I’ve only had it a week but I love the ease of use and smooth gear changes, yes there is a bit of chatter in some gears but it isn’t off putting.
Happy bunny so far!
@ StuWW: I have all the respect in the world for Thorn, but that 48 hole conversion and wheel build leaves me scratching my head.
I am not the only owner of a mountain tandem running a 32H Speedhub with no issues. The aforementioned wide, tall and symmetrical flanges go a long way towards building up a stout wheel.
To drill the 16 spoke holes where they did, and lace the spokes radially, seems as though it would be a compromise to the strength of the flange. Maybe by adding 16 more spokes, they figure they can reduce the concentrated stresses at any given point? I don’t know, but ultimately Thorn knows best as they would be the one to deal with any failure issues.
Lastly, while I understand the need to overlap the crossed spokes in order to avoid conflict with the radial spokes, I question why they weren’t reversed, with the crossed spokes’ elbows out for wider triangulation, and the radial spokes on the inside of the flange.
@Speedub.Nate You’ve got me worried now mate!!!! I was just going with advice that they gave me, I’m by no means a wheel expert! In my simplistic mind more spokes = stronger wheel 🙂
I am 19 stone and will be carrying a heavy load on a long distance tour on rough roads; not sure if that explains the type of build!
No, don’t be worried. Trust Thorn, they’re very good at what they’re do. I’d just be very interested to hear their reasoning behind this.
I’ve known two people with Speedhubs who’ve moved them on very quickly well about a 1,000 miles of use after just not really getting on with them. I’m certainly not a nay sayer I’m quite prepared to give one a go. It almost seems that you get lucky with them though you get a hub that works perfectly or you don’t. By peoples own admissions here there’s a noticable difference in how hubs perform. That strikes me odd for something that’s supposed to be precision engineered no?
After all the nicely adjusted derailleur setups I’m used to all feel and sound identical when kept clean. I rather suspect that a Shimano variant would almost certainly be a better product, as they’ve got proper money and resources to throw at this sort of thing.
I’m really eager to try both a Rohloff and one of the new Shimano 11 speed Alfine hubs.
I have recently obtained a second hand rohloff, 3 years old, there is a bit of resistance when the back wheel freewheels, such that the pedals some times turn if you spin the backwheel. I’ve done the oil change recently. Any ideas how I might rectify this or is it a question of the hub wearing in further? Regards,
sam
@sam, let’s see if I can get this right: IIRC, it should only do this in certain gears, and can sometimes be solved by a few drops of a lightweight oil under the main seals on either side of the hub (the drive side seal is hidden under the cog). The hub does supposedly become less efficient when the crank is held stationary while the bike is coasting (vs. “idling” the crank while coasting, i.e. pedaling without actually doing any real work).
Take this advice at face value because it’s from tidbits I picked up here and there over the years, and can’t back it up. One of my hubs windmills when I push the bike (the others don’t); I’ve never been bothered enough by it to oil the seal, and of course I’ve go no way to verify the lower efficiency while coasting.
Yes, Nate I see how it is going to be a tiny bit more efficient when pedalling therefore. (or perhaps not because the person pedalling makes up for this energy loss even if it is slight? anyway..!) I think in most gears there is a slight ‘windmill’ So does accessing the seals require any stripdown or is it a case of dropping a bit of oil on either side andletting it sink in.
Im nor sure how much mileage the previous owner put on it but I suspect enought to wear in the hub slightly.
And one more thing if I’m not getting quite the value out of the top gear on the flat would anyone recommend swapping to a 15t sprocket from 16t? Am guessing this is going to be ok with the chain, etc?
Many thanks in advance- this is a really good forum!
Sam
The driveside seal is hidden underneath the cog. Here’s a line from the Speedhub manual:
Pushing The Bike:
Should the bike be pushed, it is possible that the cranks could also start to turn. This occurs
due to the hub seal automatically activating the sprocket. Bad seals and a very light running
bottom bracket make it easier for the cranks to turn. A drop of lubricant change assistant
fluid (Art.N° 8402) through the holes in the sprocket onto the hub seal will reduce this
acivating effect.
How old is your hub, or rather, what’s the serial number? Somewhere around s/n 25,000 +/- a few thousand, Rohloff changed from double seals per side to single, reduced-friction seals. This is an inexpensive (although for the most part, unnecessary) retrofit available to older hubs and could settle this issue you’re experiencing.
Although the hub internals become smoother as they wear in, the exterior seal is subject to dirt and wear and will worsen with age (friction and eventual leaking).
To increase gearing, you can either do as you propose and keep or shorten your chain, or switch to a larger chainring and possibly have to lengthen your chain, depending on your setup. Cogs wear faster as they decrease in size, but a 1T difference isn’t going to be anything dramatic.
its 61692!
29-inch Rohloff
I have been using Rohloff with 29-inch Schwalbe FatBoy tires on 40 mm wide rims, on a special welded Titus titanium sit-up frame.
With two front chain-rings, and disc brakes.
I also use a modified 26-inch Cannondale with Rohloff, and two chainrings, and discs.
I have changed the chainrings a few times to get them comfortable. Actually two is a silly waste with 14 gears, so when I get time I will go back to one.
At my 110 kg plus camping gear, and with this frame length, Ti has too low a modulus, so I will replace the 29 frame with large dia steel tubes – essentially a steel Cannondale. (Does anyone know where I can get such a frame made in lightweight tubes?)
In 5 years in Munich, I have never heard of a Rohloff needing any service, except 1 leaky seal and cable broken in an accident. Fixed by me or my local dealer. This is for city, long distance cruising, and Alpine climbing.
The 7th gear noise is annoying, and I always wonder if this spinning is wasting energy.
So weight and cost are the negatives. The reliability and comfort justify the little weight contribution to a full set-up bike.
If price is a problem, you should not drive a Lamborghini.
I would never even think of a derailleur again.
Now I will look at a Swiss http://www.Katz-bikes.com , with enclosed chain and Rohloff. But they don’t make a 29.
I have a Rohloff built into my daily errand bike (a lightweight steel frame 700c 28mm tyres, drop bars, ie a standard old school roadbike but a custom frame built for the hub)…has around 2,000 kilometers on it. I find the Rohloff to be very draggy, if I’m riding with other people, and we coast together downhill, it’s like I have a drag brake on, they get way ahead, i have to pedal to keep up. So there’s definetly a lot of drag. Any suggestions beyond the oil onto the seals? And even pedalling, even in the top 7 range, it’s definetely a lot more effort than with a reasonably clean derailer setup; I find when I get back on my derailler bike, which is essentially the same frame and weight as the rolhoff specific frame (so re the questions about weight…no difference)…that I FLY! So what to do about the drag?
There must be something wrong with your Rohloff. If it is draggy in all gears, it may have the wrong oil injected, or an incompatible mix of oils.
My 29-inch with Schwalbe tires, with Rohloff, coasts downhill better than all of my friends.
Whatever Rohloff says, I would not expect it to be as efficient as a clean, well set-up chain. Particularly in the buzzy 7th gear. But for a street or mountain bike it should be close enough. And much more reliable and maintenance free.
I have two of them in constant street and mountain use in Munich.
But expensive, even here in Germany, and I am afraid that a cheaper Shimano competitor will kill it.
Rhinotec@frazier.de
Interesting. I have changed the oil several times thinking that might be it (using only the Rohloff oil direct from Rohloff, ie their oil change kit). No difference. I thought that after 1k it’d settle down, but actually it’s at 2500 km with no difference. Any other suggestions?
its nice to see my last name in a company!!!!!!
OMG, mee too, soo niice, wowee
Just welded up the frame on my cannondale (crack’n’fail) bad boy rohloff. Nice bike and quick too but I’m not sure the frame’s up to much. Interesting to note that bike shops strongly discouraged this and recommended I throw it away and buy a new one.
Would be interested to see if anyone else has had similar issues with this frame or cannondale.
Piss poor service at the cannondale warranty department. They didnt even want to sell me a new frame.
Did the frame crack on the non-drive side near the dropout?
Actually all around the seattube, crossbar junction. Is the area you mentioned susceptible?
Yes, there have been a few documented cases of steel and aluminum frames failing at the weld either on the chainstay or seatstay, likely due to the toque the hub braces against the frame. But there haven’t been enough instances for me to be alarmed. I personally haven’t experienced the problem, and you’ve got to do a bit of searching to find those who have. Known, but not common.
Yes I think a long seat-tube can help.
As an aerospace materials engineer, but without any special knowledge of Cannondale’s alloy or process, I would say that welding their frames is probably unwise. These are probably welded, then heat-treated in an oven – all under precise conditions that you do not know or have facilities for. If welding repair is possible, Cannondale should provide instructions.
In Europe welding a hardened aluminum frame and putting the bike in public is probably illegal.
I have used 26 inch Cannondales all over Europe and Africa, and never seen a crack, tho often I wonder if I may need to carry my bike home in countries like Tanzania which has no aluminum welding at all.
Steel is still the only thing for big-frame bikes (29ers) with heavy riders. Titanium and aluminium have too low a modulus. I have all three.
And Rohloff is the only way. No maintenance, and never need adjustment.
Maybe Connondale has not done enough stress analysis for 29 inch, and particularly with Rohloff.
Your was rejected.
Your “tim@bluecollarmtb.com” was rejected.
Yes I agree, but getting any information from them was fruitless. I have heard the point about the weld weakening the frame further due to it already being heat treated.
But Im curious to know how long the weld might last. The guy also put little triangles in the right angle of the seat post which might help to further support it.
I think a tig welder was used.
I am looking at a used bike, Ti frame 29er with a Rohloff Speedhub. I weigh about 180lbs. My primary riding is long cross country mt biking and also like to race (both long and short races). Any comments or suggestions?
Weld mentioned in post 44 is still holding, i am pleased to report!
This is with daily riding since then in london. So not too brutal, but still lasted longer than most people though.
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Rohloff is a great product. No question about it, but the service availability of any system, equipment, etc. is determined by Mean Time Between Failures (MTBF) and Mean Time To Repair(MTTR). Number of qualified Rohloff repair facilities is far less than those for Boeing Jumbo jet around the world. Its MTTR figure must be very poor. I would rather use Shimano, SRAM or Sturmy Archer.