With plenty of rides now logged in on the Gates Carbon Drive Center Track set up on the Trek Fisher Collection Sawyer, I am ready to finalize this review. If you want a refresher on my previous thoughts, you can check out the First Impressions here . This post will be focused primarily on the performance of the Center Track system since I have been riding it.
The Set Up: The Fisher Collection Sawyer, (see review here, was a perfect test bed for the Center Track system, since it came with a belt drive compatible drive side drop out. This drop out design is very well done and caused no issues with regard to the ride quality of the Sawyer, and no issues with the looks as well. In fact, a lot of folks are surprised when they look at the frame, since the slot is so well hidden amongst the sliding drop out mechanism.
The Center Track cogs caused no issues with regard to belt line up, nor did they force me into any funky shifting over of the crank set, spacer use, nor did the cogs have to be run in an odd way to make things work. As it should be. I should say that we have had to do all of the above with Gates older Carbon Drive belt system.
There was the one issue with being able to fit the bike with the shortest chain stay set up possible. That is something a belt driven system will have a hard time getting you. In a practical sense, it would be nearly impossible to accomplish this shortest chain stay set up unless every manufacturer designs around belt drive parameters. A chain set up is much easier to tweak in this regard, considering half links and all. Obviously, not everyone will care to have that dimension be as short as possible, but for those that do, a Center Track set up might be a limiting factor.
However; it has come to my attention that once Gates gets more options out and available, this will be addressed. (Latest word is that several more belt lengths will be out in October.) The difference in two belt teeth is slightly less than two chain links. (22mm vs 25.4mm) So, given that the availability becomes as Gates has promised, your Carbon Drive set up might end up becoming more precisely adjustable. (You’ll still need extra belts to accomplish this, where with a chain you’ll only be required to purchase one chain and a few quick links, a half link, or a chain tool.)
–Ride Performance: Obviously, Gates has a long list of benefits of running Center Track for you to consider. There are only a few that really matter though. Here are the benefits that Center Track does provide a single speed rider.
–Lighter Weight: For maximum weight savings on a single speed racing bike, Center Track does shave grams with the belt itself, and the cogs a wash in regards to chain drive cogs, ( Considering that a cassette free hub wheel must be used as a carrier for the belt cog, we are not comparing to a free wheel/cog set up). It is especially a closer difference now that the rear cog for a Center Track set up is CNC’ed stainless steel. Essentially, the biggest weight savings now is between that of the chain and the belt. (And that is significant, by the way.)
Durability and Reliability: Finally, I can say without hesitation that this version of Carbon Drive, Center Track, is totally worth my trust. It hasn’t caused me any concerns when riding trail. The tension necessary for the belt to stay put is not as high as it needs to be on former Carbon Drive iterations, and therefore the component life should remain normal, not affected by excessive tension. The belt is said to be a much longer lasting component than a chain, so as time rolls on, we shall see how this pans out, but I have no reason to doubt this claim at this time.
Only an unfortunate accident, or perhaps an ill timed rock might cause an issue. Damage to the belt is a concern, so I will be watching this as time goes on as well.
Efficiency: In the cases where a chain may be affected by moisture, grit, and grime, the Center Track should be a system that retains efficiency and has less problems with severe conditions. I’ve yet to get this one I have into those situations, but that will be tested. Obviously, if the Center Track doesn’t have anything to attract dirt, or places for it to hide, one would assume it will perform with better efficiency and better results than a chain would. Our contributor, c_g, seems to feel that Carbon Drive is well suited to tackling these situations, so I feel confident Center Track will perform well in this regard.
Just Getting Started: In some ways, this Final Review is really another new beginning. As mentioned above, there are a few things I’d like to tackle with Carbon Drive that I haven’t had a chance to…..yet! 🙂 That will come later. However; there is the issue of how it works now, and in that regard, I only have one complaint. That is the lack of currently available choices for ratios, and the necessary belt/cog combos I would have to accumulate to satisfy my set ups.
Once Gates gets enough options produced, the choices should be covered. (Latest word is by Christmas 2011 this should happen) The thing that gets to be a bit of a hindrance is that with some combos, I will need to have not just a cog, but a belt to fit the choice. With a chain, adjustability and flexibility is much better in regard to changing ratios, but it isn’t impossible with a belt set up. It’s just going to cost more. There, I said it! Carbon Belt Drive is a premium product that will not come cheaply. If the benefits make sense, (and you have an appropriate frame 😉 ), the system may be worth it to you to check out.
Conclusions: I like this version of Carbon Drive. It addresses all the issues of the past, and renders all previous editions of Carbon Drive as sub-standard in my opinion. This may sound harsh to those already invested into Carbon Drive systems, but Gates has raised the bar on performance, fit, and function with Center Track. Period. It surpasses anything else they have made that I have tried hands down.
Once Gates gets a good selection of ratio combinations readily available, this system should be high on the list for those seeking a premium performing single speed bike set up. There still are a few “prerequisites” to owning a belt set up, and primarily that is having a frame compatible with Carbon Drive. Fortunately, there are several good choices in 29″ers that will accommodate you here.
I wouldn’t recommend this to folks converting a geared bike, converting a non-carbon drive frame to belt drive, or to folks who adhere to the roots of single speed philosophy 😉 . It might appeal to you from a weight savings stand point, and from a durability/longevity stand point. Whatever it does to appeal to a particular individual, one thing can now be said that couldn’t be said before with certainty: That is, Center Track is a viable, high performance system you can rely on without any “negative baggage” that came along with previous versions of the belt drive.
Now lets make lighter chains. Has there been any new technology that makes chains lighter or stronger in the last 30 years? Good report! Are there really that many off-the-self frames that are belt friendly?
So a bashguard would be a good investment if you have a belt and tend to smash your chainring into stuff?
I wonder if the groove in the belt will pack up with mud…
@yogi: Chains have by necessity been getting lighter due to the addition of more cogs in the drive train. Also, the hollow pin and windowed link chains have shown that lighter weight chains are a possibility. Still, I don’t see anything that could possibly rival the weight of a Center Track belt.
There are not “a lot” of belt compatible 29″er frames, but the ones that are out there are good. Grannygear is testing a Spot Brand bike now that he has said is quite nice. I’m sure others exist and more are coming. Stay tuned for the Eurobike coverage. c_g will have a bit to add to the current list of frames and should have some more info regarding Center Track soon.
@dgaddis: Yeah, I could see where a bash guard would be nice. As for the Center Track collecting mud, that is something I will prove out when the opportunities present themselves, but the fin on the cog should clear the groove in the belt with a “squeegee” type action, I would think. We’ll see….
How about “carbon” chains or titanium chains? Sounds like the only possible problem might be little pebbles “stuck” in the belt groove. Aside from the gears, would belts be good on fat/snow bikes?
@yogi: Actually, back in the 90’s a chain was sold that was made in titanium. It came in a lined wooden presentation case and sold for north of $500.00. Viking chain, if I recall correctly. But yeah….carbon or titanium chains wouldn’t save you the same amount of weight, and would likely be far more expensive than the Center Track belt system.
I’d be very curious to hear from anyone who’s tried one of the new Center Track systems on a Rohloff using the 46/19 combo – does it slip without the snubber (or are they even offering the snubber with the Center Track)? Does the lower tension with the Center Track system cause the hub to drag at all?
great report, Bro GT! Thanks!
I also wanna try this Center Track carbon belt system to my sawyer. In fact I’v been exchanging emails with Gates Team since last month. However I havent heard anything from them more than a week now. I have even forwarded your review (http://twentynineinches.com/2011/07/19/gates-carbon-drive-center-trackfirst-impressions/) to Gates for ease of reference.
Anyway, got a quick question: Does the 39x24t with 113 teeth best fit the sawyer considering this bikes has a long wheelbase?
thanks in advance.
newbie
@newbie: Thanks! 🙂 The Sawyer’s earlier production run needs a bit of dremmeling to the drop out to fit the next shorter belt than the one I showed. Newer Sawyers got a tweak to allow that belt with no mods. You should be okay with the 118 T belt if you have a later production Sawyer. I have a 122T on it now. the 118 should get you the shortest possible chain stay setting. 🙂
All the above sounds very promising. However, does it all apply if the Gates CT is used in conjunction with a Rohloff hub? Furthermore, it appears that snow sometimes clogged the older version of the belt drive. Any comments`?
@AZ: our Euro correspondent, c_g has used a Rohloff with the older gates carbon Drive with much success. I can’t imagine that the new CT wouldn’t make it even better. I aim to try the Center Track system in winter snow when that season arrives, as I have an aim to put a Center Track on a fat bike with an IGH hub at some point. 🙂
I have a Sawyer that I am planning to convert. What are the main specs of the cog/chainring/belt that you used? Also, where can you purchase the new center track system? My LBS is not much help in that regard. Thanks.
Frankie, give Gates a call. They walked me through everything I needed for my Sawyer build. They now have different sized belts that are more suitable to the Sawyer install.
I just switched my Sawyer to the center drive belt system last week. I am using a 46×24 setup and a 118 belt. It is unbelievably smooth and I can switch to a 22 or 26 rear cog with the same belt. The rear cogs are a beautiful piece of stainless steel, but are very expensive. The guy at Gates was very helpful with determining the right setup and they have a cog/belt calculator on their website. I was told that the manufacturer’s chainstay length was the minimum distance on adjustable rear dropouts. 2 sense…
I don’t comment, but I looked at a ton of comments on this page Gates Carbon Drive Center Track: Final Review. I actually do have a few questions for you if you do not mind. Could it be simply me or does it look like a few of the responses appear as if they are written by brain dead visitors? 😛 And, if you are writing at other places, I would like to keep up with everything new you have to post. Could you make a list of every one of your social community pages like your linkedin profile, Facebook page or twitter feed?
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I am very curious to hear what kind of chain lines you’re having on your bikes.
I am trying to get a NuVinci 360 in my Sawyer, but it has a chainline like 44mm. Where I can’t get less than 49mm in the front.
Is anybody riding his Sawyer with a belt and hub gears?
Soy el poseedor de una bici 29″ Mi:Tech con Rohloff y sistema “Center Track”, actualmente tiene 9.500 km. y los desgastes son mayores de lo esperado:
Correa 3.500 km (actualmente es la 3ª)
Piñón 6.000 km
Plato 8.500 km
Your mode of explaining all in this paragraph is genuinely fastidious, every one be able to easily be aware of it,
Thanks a lot.
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I just bought a single speed carbon drive centerline setup. Overall this has been great in dry conditions. Today I raced it in a very muddy race and the belt kept popping off, my tension was correct, again very muddy. Has anybody any suggestions? Thanks christian
@Christian, if you are talking about the belt dropping off the side, you need to make sure your beltline is straight. Centertrack is more sensitive to beltline than Mudport.
However, if you are talking about your belt skipping teeth, Centertrack is supposedly less prone to doing this than Mudport, but if you are still getting that to skip under high load, there are a couple of things to consider to prevent it from skipping.
The first is tension. You might even want to try over tensioning the belt a bit. Obviously you don’t want to tension the belt so much that it might get damaged, but know that when the belt skips, the belt gets damaged then, too.
That leads me to the 2nd factor: a fresh belt. If your belt skips it might make itself more prone to skipping again, since it could wear down the teeth on the belt. If you can call gates and get your belt replaced, then take better care to tension your 2nd belt.
The last reason your belt might skip, other than mud or water, is a flexy frame. Obviously you’re not going to want to have to buy a whole new frame just to fix a skipping belt, but just know that steel frames are more prone to skipping than aluminum ones, as the flex under high load will cause the drive-side beltstay to shorten slightly, making the belt skip.
Hope this helps! ~RICK