<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: Motobecane Introduces A Titanium 29&#8243;er Hardtail</title>
	<atom:link href="http://twentynineinches.com/2009/02/27/motobecane-introduces-a-titanium-29er-hardtail/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://twentynineinches.com/2009/02/27/motobecane-introduces-a-titanium-29er-hardtail/</link>
	<description>29er Bike Reviews, Rumors and News</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sat, 21 Nov 2009 06:18:41 -0800</lastBuildDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8</generator>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
		<item>
		<title>By: tiredofbs</title>
		<link>http://twentynineinches.com/2009/02/27/motobecane-introduces-a-titanium-29er-hardtail/comment-page-1/#comment-60808</link>
		<dc:creator>tiredofbs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 28 Aug 2009 20:07:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://twentynineinches.com/?p=2182#comment-60808</guid>
		<description>&gt;&gt;OutofShapeNeedtoRide

well, its not only a tune up.  the reason why i said &quot;a month after getting the bike&quot; is because you will be having the LBS do most of your wrenching.  Here&#039;s why:

Tune up service:
You will need a tune up service after a month of initial use on which you are basically breaking in a new bike.  During this month your cables stretch, seals settle in, pads settle in, wheels need to be relieved and trued as your spokes will finally settle in.  Most, if not all, new bike owners have to do a tune-up.

Complete Bike Rebuild:
This service is pretty costly but it is worth it.  In some bike shops, they specifically don&#039;t call this a tune up but rather an &quot;bike overhaul&quot;.  Basically, the bike will be taken apart, cleaned and lubed then tightened and adjusted to the correct torque settings according to manufacturers specifications.  This service also covers what a tune up service covers.

Basically, these are two different services.  But the reason why i say that you should bring your bike a month after you have initially used it is so that you can save money by just getting a complete bike rebuilt (bike overhaul) instead of getting the services separately.

if i was in your shoes, i would do the rebuild (bike overhaul) right after one really short ride (ride around the block).  then after a month of use, i will do a bike tune-up without tearing the bike apart.  i do my overhaul once a year and tune up before each riding season (summer and winter).  i would do this because i have my own tools, time, and inclination to tear and rebuild a bike from bearings up.  your case however is different because you will have to pay for each service</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&gt;&gt;OutofShapeNeedtoRide</p>
<p>well, its not only a tune up.  the reason why i said &#8220;a month after getting the bike&#8221; is because you will be having the LBS do most of your wrenching.  Here&#8217;s why:</p>
<p>Tune up service:<br />
You will need a tune up service after a month of initial use on which you are basically breaking in a new bike.  During this month your cables stretch, seals settle in, pads settle in, wheels need to be relieved and trued as your spokes will finally settle in.  Most, if not all, new bike owners have to do a tune-up.</p>
<p>Complete Bike Rebuild:<br />
This service is pretty costly but it is worth it.  In some bike shops, they specifically don&#8217;t call this a tune up but rather an &#8220;bike overhaul&#8221;.  Basically, the bike will be taken apart, cleaned and lubed then tightened and adjusted to the correct torque settings according to manufacturers specifications.  This service also covers what a tune up service covers.</p>
<p>Basically, these are two different services.  But the reason why i say that you should bring your bike a month after you have initially used it is so that you can save money by just getting a complete bike rebuilt (bike overhaul) instead of getting the services separately.</p>
<p>if i was in your shoes, i would do the rebuild (bike overhaul) right after one really short ride (ride around the block).  then after a month of use, i will do a bike tune-up without tearing the bike apart.  i do my overhaul once a year and tune up before each riding season (summer and winter).  i would do this because i have my own tools, time, and inclination to tear and rebuild a bike from bearings up.  your case however is different because you will have to pay for each service</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Keith Hunter</title>
		<link>http://twentynineinches.com/2009/02/27/motobecane-introduces-a-titanium-29er-hardtail/comment-page-1/#comment-60807</link>
		<dc:creator>Keith Hunter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 28 Aug 2009 17:40:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://twentynineinches.com/?p=2182#comment-60807</guid>
		<description>That&#039;s it... take it apart, clean, lube, adjust and tighten to spec&#039;. That&#039;s what a good shop does on every new bike build. Many times, you&#039;ll evenwant to shorten the cable housing.  Back in the old days when the hubs, BB&#039;s, and headsets were cup and cone, set up was more time consuming.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That&#8217;s it&#8230; take it apart, clean, lube, adjust and tighten to spec&#8217;. That&#8217;s what a good shop does on every new bike build. Many times, you&#8217;ll evenwant to shorten the cable housing.  Back in the old days when the hubs, BB&#8217;s, and headsets were cup and cone, set up was more time consuming.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: OutofShapeNeedtoRide</title>
		<link>http://twentynineinches.com/2009/02/27/motobecane-introduces-a-titanium-29er-hardtail/comment-page-1/#comment-60805</link>
		<dc:creator>OutofShapeNeedtoRide</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 28 Aug 2009 16:15:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://twentynineinches.com/?p=2182#comment-60805</guid>
		<description>My technical expertise goes only as far as fixing a flat so thanks to all the folks for their comments. 

tiredofbs, 

&quot;it is recommended that you rebuild the complete bike within one month after getting them because a lot of the parts were only minimally lubricated.&quot;

Is that the same as a tune up?   Does the complete bike rebuild mean the LBS take the bike apart, lube/clean the parts, and then reassemble it?    

Thanks</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My technical expertise goes only as far as fixing a flat so thanks to all the folks for their comments. </p>
<p>tiredofbs, </p>
<p>&#8220;it is recommended that you rebuild the complete bike within one month after getting them because a lot of the parts were only minimally lubricated.&#8221;</p>
<p>Is that the same as a tune up?   Does the complete bike rebuild mean the LBS take the bike apart, lube/clean the parts, and then reassemble it?    </p>
<p>Thanks</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Keith Hunter</title>
		<link>http://twentynineinches.com/2009/02/27/motobecane-introduces-a-titanium-29er-hardtail/comment-page-1/#comment-60792</link>
		<dc:creator>Keith Hunter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 28 Aug 2009 00:19:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://twentynineinches.com/?p=2182#comment-60792</guid>
		<description>It doesn&#039;t take much to do an initial build on a bike, especially if you are mechanically inclined and do some of your own wrenching as it is. As said above, if the guys in the shop give you attitude about your Motobecane, go to another shop. 

The My last purchase was a Motobecane Outcast 29er single speed. When I got it, I raided my parts bin and other than the cranks and brakes, there is nothing left that was a original to the bike. I even eventually built up a new wheelset. It was a quality bike, and for my commuting application, even the original components were okay, but a bit heavy. I can just never leave well enough alone. When it comes to bike and guitars, I am always tinkering. 

The Fly 29r Titanium has a quality component package, so you should need or want to change anything out. The only complaints I have heard about are the bar witdth (too narrow) and the Ritchey foam grips. Those two things and saddles are very much personal preference.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It doesn&#8217;t take much to do an initial build on a bike, especially if you are mechanically inclined and do some of your own wrenching as it is. As said above, if the guys in the shop give you attitude about your Motobecane, go to another shop. </p>
<p>The My last purchase was a Motobecane Outcast 29er single speed. When I got it, I raided my parts bin and other than the cranks and brakes, there is nothing left that was a original to the bike. I even eventually built up a new wheelset. It was a quality bike, and for my commuting application, even the original components were okay, but a bit heavy. I can just never leave well enough alone. When it comes to bike and guitars, I am always tinkering. </p>
<p>The Fly 29r Titanium has a quality component package, so you should need or want to change anything out. The only complaints I have heard about are the bar witdth (too narrow) and the Ritchey foam grips. Those two things and saddles are very much personal preference.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: tiredofbs</title>
		<link>http://twentynineinches.com/2009/02/27/motobecane-introduces-a-titanium-29er-hardtail/comment-page-1/#comment-60790</link>
		<dc:creator>tiredofbs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Aug 2009 23:37:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://twentynineinches.com/?p=2182#comment-60790</guid>
		<description>&gt;&gt;OutofShapeNeedtoRide

bikesdirect bikes are basically 88-95% assembled.   they also provide a video that would help you finish that assembly.

but if you don&#039;t have a hint of mechanical prowess in you or you simply don&#039;t have time your LBS should be happy to build up the bike and fit it to you--at least the good ones do.    of course most shops would charge you for it.  i go to JensonUSA here in SoCal and they are willing to work on my bikes including doing warranties for my broken parts and stuff like those even though i have never bought a bike from them (not a yeti fan).  but that is probably because i buy their stuff and use their services a lot.  but, a warning though:  there are a lot of jerks, idiots and fools (most of whom do not even have a college education) that work or own bike shops and they would surely comment on BD bikes.  its probably because they know that they lose a lot of business to online retailers especially BD.  if you get one, and feel offended, walk out the door right away and find a better one. hey, its your money.

also, from what i heard from some BD customers, it is recommended that you rebuild the complete bike within one month after getting them because a lot of the parts were only minimally lubricated.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&gt;&gt;OutofShapeNeedtoRide</p>
<p>bikesdirect bikes are basically 88-95% assembled.   they also provide a video that would help you finish that assembly.</p>
<p>but if you don&#8217;t have a hint of mechanical prowess in you or you simply don&#8217;t have time your LBS should be happy to build up the bike and fit it to you&#8211;at least the good ones do.    of course most shops would charge you for it.  i go to JensonUSA here in SoCal and they are willing to work on my bikes including doing warranties for my broken parts and stuff like those even though i have never bought a bike from them (not a yeti fan).  but that is probably because i buy their stuff and use their services a lot.  but, a warning though:  there are a lot of jerks, idiots and fools (most of whom do not even have a college education) that work or own bike shops and they would surely comment on BD bikes.  its probably because they know that they lose a lot of business to online retailers especially BD.  if you get one, and feel offended, walk out the door right away and find a better one. hey, its your money.</p>
<p>also, from what i heard from some BD customers, it is recommended that you rebuild the complete bike within one month after getting them because a lot of the parts were only minimally lubricated.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Broke Cyclist</title>
		<link>http://twentynineinches.com/2009/02/27/motobecane-introduces-a-titanium-29er-hardtail/comment-page-1/#comment-60789</link>
		<dc:creator>Broke Cyclist</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Aug 2009 21:46:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://twentynineinches.com/?p=2182#comment-60789</guid>
		<description>Support your local bike shop by giving them the business putting it together for you.

I&#039;m doing my comparisons of my next new bike for winter training and what I want costs $2500.00 plus tax.  What I&#039;m probably going to buy from BikesDirect is $999.00 with a much better spec.  Thats $1500.00 I&#039;m going to spend on a ski trip to Colorado.

Last years industry mark up of 15-20% because they wanted to still pisses me off.  Motorcycle industry which builds all different sizes (basically whole new bikes not just a different frame size) was less than 5% which compensate for inflation approximately.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Support your local bike shop by giving them the business putting it together for you.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m doing my comparisons of my next new bike for winter training and what I want costs $2500.00 plus tax.  What I&#8217;m probably going to buy from BikesDirect is $999.00 with a much better spec.  Thats $1500.00 I&#8217;m going to spend on a ski trip to Colorado.</p>
<p>Last years industry mark up of 15-20% because they wanted to still pisses me off.  Motorcycle industry which builds all different sizes (basically whole new bikes not just a different frame size) was less than 5% which compensate for inflation approximately.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Keith Hunter</title>
		<link>http://twentynineinches.com/2009/02/27/motobecane-introduces-a-titanium-29er-hardtail/comment-page-1/#comment-60786</link>
		<dc:creator>Keith Hunter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Aug 2009 21:31:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://twentynineinches.com/?p=2182#comment-60786</guid>
		<description>Just call a couple LBS and ask them if they&#039;d mind doing a new bike build. I bet they won&#039;t. I worked in a couple shops and we did that kid of thing all the time, and never thought twice about it. We were just happy to have the business. After all, that&#039;s what we there for... to make money by selling services or products.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just call a couple LBS and ask them if they&#8217;d mind doing a new bike build. I bet they won&#8217;t. I worked in a couple shops and we did that kid of thing all the time, and never thought twice about it. We were just happy to have the business. After all, that&#8217;s what we there for&#8230; to make money by selling services or products.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: OutofShapeNeedtoRide</title>
		<link>http://twentynineinches.com/2009/02/27/motobecane-introduces-a-titanium-29er-hardtail/comment-page-1/#comment-60784</link>
		<dc:creator>OutofShapeNeedtoRide</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Aug 2009 21:06:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://twentynineinches.com/?p=2182#comment-60784</guid>
		<description>Hi folks,
I&#039;m very tempted by one of these 29er Ti bikes but I really don&#039;t know much about putting together bikes.   That means I&#039;ll need to bring it to and LBS for assembly.   

What are your experiences with their LBS when they brought one of these bikedirect bikes to get assembled/serviced?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi folks,<br />
I&#8217;m very tempted by one of these 29er Ti bikes but I really don&#8217;t know much about putting together bikes.   That means I&#8217;ll need to bring it to and LBS for assembly.   </p>
<p>What are your experiences with their LBS when they brought one of these bikedirect bikes to get assembled/serviced?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: mrhogghead</title>
		<link>http://twentynineinches.com/2009/02/27/motobecane-introduces-a-titanium-29er-hardtail/comment-page-1/#comment-60150</link>
		<dc:creator>mrhogghead</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Aug 2009 15:55:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://twentynineinches.com/?p=2182#comment-60150</guid>
		<description>Tiredofbs, that was a great post! I am going to oreder mine today and laugh all the way to the bank with the money I save. I love my LBS. But they get plenty of my hard earned cash. 
Thanks for the post!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tiredofbs, that was a great post! I am going to oreder mine today and laugh all the way to the bank with the money I save. I love my LBS. But they get plenty of my hard earned cash.<br />
Thanks for the post!</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: tiredofbs</title>
		<link>http://twentynineinches.com/2009/02/27/motobecane-introduces-a-titanium-29er-hardtail/comment-page-1/#comment-60137</link>
		<dc:creator>tiredofbs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 02 Aug 2009 18:59:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://twentynineinches.com/?p=2182#comment-60137</guid>
		<description>You know, having experience in global trading and business, i wouldn&#039;t even be surprised that bikesdirect is making a lot of profit out of this.  If you really think that price is one way to judge quality, then you might need to get into global business to understand and get your perspective to change.

Let me give you an example:

I could buy shipping containers of medical pills for about $0.40 per pill.  Add about $0.0003 cents shipping for each pill.  I could ask the factories in India or China to stamp my brand on each packaging.  The hospitals i sell to will simply consider these as generic products of pills that are very comparable to other research companies.  Its not far from the truth because these pills have a comparable quality (since a lot of these pills are made by the same contractors which produces for the major research companies).

Funny thing is, I can sell them for $3.00 to $12.00 dollars per pill  to the hospitals, make a big profit, and the hospitals and pharmacies will still think that they are very good deals compared to the major brands and compared to bids by other supplier contractors.

The major companies on the other hand probably will produces the equivalent or original pill for about  $0.90 per pill and sell them for about $15.00 to $25.00 each and still will make a very good profit.

Now, you would probably be skeptical about this but guess what, that is how the global trading system works like.

High end frames from Specialized, Motobecane, Giant, most Treks, Santa Cruz, Cervelo, etc, probably cost less than $40 dollars to build.  Maybe a little bit more or maybe a lot less.  Many of these brands are produced by metallurgy or plastics companies that these major brand have contracts with (probably except Giant).  Then guess what?  They sell them for 500% to 1500% upwards profit.  They then throw a few sales to hook you and make you think they are not making a lot of profit.  Nonetheless, they are making a lot of profit.  Why do you think they can afford to pay the athletes as wells as their supporting staff and training sessions?

All of these are kept secret from the common population for obvious reasons just as I keep my mouth shut when people ask me how much profits i make from school, medical, and electrical supplies that I globally trade.

Now, my point is this.  This specific frame looks like a good frame made by a very respectable company.  Understand that Bikesdirect/Motobecane seems to contract more than a few frame builders to build their frames and a lot of other companies to make other components like their Vuelta USA wheels.  They then simply ask the frame builders to attach their own brand (motobecane, dawes, windsor) on their frames.

Why do i know these?  Simple.  i am considering getting into the biking business and possibly shipping containers of bikes to other countries and have been researching factories, components and etc.  I am about to visit two factories in taiwan and am currently looking at patent laws for certain frames and for certain countries.

So bikers, when you buy, look beyond the brand and and try to understand how the cycling manufacturing business works like.  There is a reason why they do their best to keep it a secret.  And maybe by understanding the model of business that bikesdirect follows (minimal overhead cost, purchases of large volume from manufacturers, ownership of brands, etc), you will understand why they are able to sell very cheap.  And in my humble opinion, i don&#039;t think these frames are not cheap imitations or are low quality builds.  I just think that bikesdirect is simply cutting their operating and maintenance costs to a minimum and lowering their profit margins to enable them to plant their brand into a solid footing.  My advice though is that if you are open to riding a great 29er bike with a motobecane sticker/paint (i personally am squeemish and snobby but that is because i can afford to), you may want to do so soon because bikesdirect&#039;s business model includes raising prices as soon as they get their brands (motobecane, windsor &amp; dawes) properly positioned.  Furthermore, their competitors,  ibexbikes.com, rscycles.com and performancebike.com seems to be going down the tube so it seems like a monopoly is around the corner.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You know, having experience in global trading and business, i wouldn&#8217;t even be surprised that bikesdirect is making a lot of profit out of this.  If you really think that price is one way to judge quality, then you might need to get into global business to understand and get your perspective to change.</p>
<p>Let me give you an example:</p>
<p>I could buy shipping containers of medical pills for about $0.40 per pill.  Add about $0.0003 cents shipping for each pill.  I could ask the factories in India or China to stamp my brand on each packaging.  The hospitals i sell to will simply consider these as generic products of pills that are very comparable to other research companies.  Its not far from the truth because these pills have a comparable quality (since a lot of these pills are made by the same contractors which produces for the major research companies).</p>
<p>Funny thing is, I can sell them for $3.00 to $12.00 dollars per pill  to the hospitals, make a big profit, and the hospitals and pharmacies will still think that they are very good deals compared to the major brands and compared to bids by other supplier contractors.</p>
<p>The major companies on the other hand probably will produces the equivalent or original pill for about  $0.90 per pill and sell them for about $15.00 to $25.00 each and still will make a very good profit.</p>
<p>Now, you would probably be skeptical about this but guess what, that is how the global trading system works like.</p>
<p>High end frames from Specialized, Motobecane, Giant, most Treks, Santa Cruz, Cervelo, etc, probably cost less than $40 dollars to build.  Maybe a little bit more or maybe a lot less.  Many of these brands are produced by metallurgy or plastics companies that these major brand have contracts with (probably except Giant).  Then guess what?  They sell them for 500% to 1500% upwards profit.  They then throw a few sales to hook you and make you think they are not making a lot of profit.  Nonetheless, they are making a lot of profit.  Why do you think they can afford to pay the athletes as wells as their supporting staff and training sessions?</p>
<p>All of these are kept secret from the common population for obvious reasons just as I keep my mouth shut when people ask me how much profits i make from school, medical, and electrical supplies that I globally trade.</p>
<p>Now, my point is this.  This specific frame looks like a good frame made by a very respectable company.  Understand that Bikesdirect/Motobecane seems to contract more than a few frame builders to build their frames and a lot of other companies to make other components like their Vuelta USA wheels.  They then simply ask the frame builders to attach their own brand (motobecane, dawes, windsor) on their frames.</p>
<p>Why do i know these?  Simple.  i am considering getting into the biking business and possibly shipping containers of bikes to other countries and have been researching factories, components and etc.  I am about to visit two factories in taiwan and am currently looking at patent laws for certain frames and for certain countries.</p>
<p>So bikers, when you buy, look beyond the brand and and try to understand how the cycling manufacturing business works like.  There is a reason why they do their best to keep it a secret.  And maybe by understanding the model of business that bikesdirect follows (minimal overhead cost, purchases of large volume from manufacturers, ownership of brands, etc), you will understand why they are able to sell very cheap.  And in my humble opinion, i don&#8217;t think these frames are not cheap imitations or are low quality builds.  I just think that bikesdirect is simply cutting their operating and maintenance costs to a minimum and lowering their profit margins to enable them to plant their brand into a solid footing.  My advice though is that if you are open to riding a great 29er bike with a motobecane sticker/paint (i personally am squeemish and snobby but that is because i can afford to), you may want to do so soon because bikesdirect&#8217;s business model includes raising prices as soon as they get their brands (motobecane, windsor &amp; dawes) properly positioned.  Furthermore, their competitors,  ibexbikes.com, rscycles.com and performancebike.com seems to be going down the tube so it seems like a monopoly is around the corner.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>
