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	<title>Comments on: Edge Composites XC Rims: Out Of The Box</title>
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	<description>29er Bike Reviews, Rumors and News</description>
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		<title>By: Chris</title>
		<link>http://twentynineinches.com/2008/10/10/edge-composites-xc-rims-out-of-the-box/#comment-51440</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 16 Oct 2008 22:28:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://twentynineinches.com/?p=1453#comment-51440</guid>
		<description>Good. I want you to cringe when you feel that rock hit the rim :) I had a few doozies at the end of the CTR when I was too tired to avoid rocks anymore and my tire pressure was probably in the mid 20s.

To be realistic, I&#039;ve got 2 sets of 26er Stans Olympic rims  at 330 to 360g per rim. Both sets have thousands of miles on them, all tubeless and dozens of &quot;ouch&quot; rim shots. All 4 rims show dents, mostly minor but a few less than ideal. I can&#039;t get away from the occasional rim shot unless I run tire pressures well above my liking. Despite the abuse and mostly rigid SS use, they&#039;re all essentially true and seal/hold air perfectly. I really am amazed with modern light rims as I&#039;m light but at 5&#039;11&quot;/155lbs and often loaded for my races, I&#039;m not exactly featherweight. 

The Edges have my interest but we&#039;ll see how your tests go.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good. I want you to cringe when you feel that rock hit the rim <img src='http://twentynineinches.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' />  I had a few doozies at the end of the CTR when I was too tired to avoid rocks anymore and my tire pressure was probably in the mid 20s.</p>
<p>To be realistic, I&#8217;ve got 2 sets of 26er Stans Olympic rims  at 330 to 360g per rim. Both sets have thousands of miles on them, all tubeless and dozens of &#8220;ouch&#8221; rim shots. All 4 rims show dents, mostly minor but a few less than ideal. I can&#8217;t get away from the occasional rim shot unless I run tire pressures well above my liking. Despite the abuse and mostly rigid SS use, they&#8217;re all essentially true and seal/hold air perfectly. I really am amazed with modern light rims as I&#8217;m light but at 5&#8217;11&#8243;/155lbs and often loaded for my races, I&#8217;m not exactly featherweight. </p>
<p>The Edges have my interest but we&#8217;ll see how your tests go.</p>
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		<title>By: Guitar Ted</title>
		<link>http://twentynineinches.com/2008/10/10/edge-composites-xc-rims-out-of-the-box/#comment-51439</link>
		<dc:creator>Guitar Ted</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 16 Oct 2008 22:21:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://twentynineinches.com/?p=1453#comment-51439</guid>
		<description>Chris: That&#039;s the idea here. ;) We do the testing so you don&#039;t have to. Hopefully we can do a convincing job of it. We certainly will give it our best shot. 

Just to directly address your concern now though, I was told several stories of instances where Edge Composites rims were thoroughly thrashed, dinged, and abused only to come out practically unscathed. User comments up to this point agree with the anecdotes I&#039;ve heard. I suspect that if our experiences are similar, yur fears will be allayed, but time will tell. 

I was told at Sea Otter in April that Edge does have a crash replacement warranty on the rims, so you wouldn&#039;t be out the full amount if indeed you did have an issue arise.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Chris: That&#8217;s the idea here. <img src='http://twentynineinches.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' />  We do the testing so you don&#8217;t have to. Hopefully we can do a convincing job of it. We certainly will give it our best shot. </p>
<p>Just to directly address your concern now though, I was told several stories of instances where Edge Composites rims were thoroughly thrashed, dinged, and abused only to come out practically unscathed. User comments up to this point agree with the anecdotes I&#8217;ve heard. I suspect that if our experiences are similar, yur fears will be allayed, but time will tell. </p>
<p>I was told at Sea Otter in April that Edge does have a crash replacement warranty on the rims, so you wouldn&#8217;t be out the full amount if indeed you did have an issue arise.</p>
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		<title>By: Chris</title>
		<link>http://twentynineinches.com/2008/10/10/edge-composites-xc-rims-out-of-the-box/#comment-51437</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 16 Oct 2008 21:41:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://twentynineinches.com/?p=1453#comment-51437</guid>
		<description>GTed,

Any hope you&#039;ll rim shot the crap out of this thing. Those rim prices are ABSURD but if the rims held up to bottoming out (something that happens tubeless to me) without breaking or denting, they&#039;d conceivably save me money and worry over the lifetime of the wheelset compared to Stans rims.

Please try to break them because I can&#039;t afford to beta test $800 rims. :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>GTed,</p>
<p>Any hope you&#8217;ll rim shot the crap out of this thing. Those rim prices are ABSURD but if the rims held up to bottoming out (something that happens tubeless to me) without breaking or denting, they&#8217;d conceivably save me money and worry over the lifetime of the wheelset compared to Stans rims.</p>
<p>Please try to break them because I can&#8217;t afford to beta test $800 rims. <img src='http://twentynineinches.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Davidcopperfield</title>
		<link>http://twentynineinches.com/2008/10/10/edge-composites-xc-rims-out-of-the-box/#comment-51367</link>
		<dc:creator>Davidcopperfield</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Oct 2008 20:55:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://twentynineinches.com/?p=1453#comment-51367</guid>
		<description>&quot;The rim itself can handle much higher spoke tension than most light weight spokes can handle. For example the rim can take 180kg no problem, but an aerolite spoke will have begun to stretch long before that, or you’ll break or strip out he nipple.&quot; 

This reasoning speaks for more spokes, doesn&#039;t it? More spokes= more tension to carry collectively before they begin to stretch or  strip out the nipples.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;The rim itself can handle much higher spoke tension than most light weight spokes can handle. For example the rim can take 180kg no problem, but an aerolite spoke will have begun to stretch long before that, or you’ll break or strip out he nipple.&#8221; </p>
<p>This reasoning speaks for more spokes, doesn&#8217;t it? More spokes= more tension to carry collectively before they begin to stretch or  strip out the nipples.</p>
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		<title>By: Davidcopperfield</title>
		<link>http://twentynineinches.com/2008/10/10/edge-composites-xc-rims-out-of-the-box/#comment-51366</link>
		<dc:creator>Davidcopperfield</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Oct 2008 20:49:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://twentynineinches.com/?p=1453#comment-51366</guid>
		<description>@Z34ME
I am no denying that 32H isn&#039;t durable, you are right. I am just saying that 36H would improve the wheels without adding unnecessary weight as some of you are trying to hint.

You are saying that 32h 29er AM rim is enough but 32H 26er rim AM is stronger, thus why not adding 4 spokes for 29er version to cancel out that difference more or less? Bigger wheel should have more spokes, shouldn&#039;t it?
All i am hearing is that 32H is enough for 29er, yet 32 for 26er is
enough as well and the difference exists. Consider it nobody complains that 32H on 26er is too much, few venture to go 28H on a 26er so they use overkill-like wheels in your opinion?
Following your logic 32H in 26er is overkill, yet it is offered. Why? Is it silly?

&quot;For one the exit/entry angles of the spokes into the rim. The Edge wheels are designed with molded spoke holes and for internal nipples. The nipple seats are conical and designed so that the nipple can articulate with the exit angle of the spoke. If the angle is too aggresive, then the nipple will force the spoke to bend or curve in an undesirable manner. Edge suggests that you do no more than a 2 cross pattern, but depending on the hub a 3 cross is just fine.&quot;

This is a design issue in this particular 32H 29er rim not the overall impossibility. Apparently a 29er 36H Edge to fully accept 3 and 4 lacing pattern would have to be designed differently to optimize them and at simulataneously exclude 2x patterns. I contacted Edge on this very issue and they&#039;ve written:

&quot;I understand what you are saying.  The problem lies in the fact that due to
our manufacturing process, you need an individual mold for each hole count
of rim.  It is not as simple as just starting to drill 36 hole rims.  Each
hole count and rim shape has its own mold.  These molds are very expensive,
and so far very few people have made a request for a 36 hole rim.  We
generally try to make what the people want, but we need to see the demand
for it in order to justify the cost of cutting the tooling.  If we see an
increase in 36 hole requests, we will likely make them.

In the meantime when you want to demo a pair of wheels let me know.&quot;

The problem lies in R&amp;D costs and demand not in viability.  I believe that 32H is enough strong, but what it takes to add 20-30 grams per wheel on a AM 29er rig to get a sbustantially stonger wheelset? If you feel that AM edge 32H 2x is indestructible then how would 4x 36H behave? I am sure it will last for longer and stay true for years after 32H 3x needs trueing. 

As long as Edge makes 32H 26er wheels I will not believe that 36H would be overkill. Larger wheel at the same hub flange spacing is always weaker than its smaller counterpart, thus why my wheels should be inferior to my buddy&#039;s on a 26er?

Once that I own a 36H 4X wheelset I really believe in these particular numbers on 29er. How many of yous own 4x 36h wheelsets to chime in?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Z34ME<br />
I am no denying that 32H isn&#8217;t durable, you are right. I am just saying that 36H would improve the wheels without adding unnecessary weight as some of you are trying to hint.</p>
<p>You are saying that 32h 29er AM rim is enough but 32H 26er rim AM is stronger, thus why not adding 4 spokes for 29er version to cancel out that difference more or less? Bigger wheel should have more spokes, shouldn&#8217;t it?<br />
All i am hearing is that 32H is enough for 29er, yet 32 for 26er is<br />
enough as well and the difference exists. Consider it nobody complains that 32H on 26er is too much, few venture to go 28H on a 26er so they use overkill-like wheels in your opinion?<br />
Following your logic 32H in 26er is overkill, yet it is offered. Why? Is it silly?</p>
<p>&#8220;For one the exit/entry angles of the spokes into the rim. The Edge wheels are designed with molded spoke holes and for internal nipples. The nipple seats are conical and designed so that the nipple can articulate with the exit angle of the spoke. If the angle is too aggresive, then the nipple will force the spoke to bend or curve in an undesirable manner. Edge suggests that you do no more than a 2 cross pattern, but depending on the hub a 3 cross is just fine.&#8221;</p>
<p>This is a design issue in this particular 32H 29er rim not the overall impossibility. Apparently a 29er 36H Edge to fully accept 3 and 4 lacing pattern would have to be designed differently to optimize them and at simulataneously exclude 2x patterns. I contacted Edge on this very issue and they&#8217;ve written:</p>
<p>&#8220;I understand what you are saying.  The problem lies in the fact that due to<br />
our manufacturing process, you need an individual mold for each hole count<br />
of rim.  It is not as simple as just starting to drill 36 hole rims.  Each<br />
hole count and rim shape has its own mold.  These molds are very expensive,<br />
and so far very few people have made a request for a 36 hole rim.  We<br />
generally try to make what the people want, but we need to see the demand<br />
for it in order to justify the cost of cutting the tooling.  If we see an<br />
increase in 36 hole requests, we will likely make them.</p>
<p>In the meantime when you want to demo a pair of wheels let me know.&#8221;</p>
<p>The problem lies in R&amp;D costs and demand not in viability.  I believe that 32H is enough strong, but what it takes to add 20-30 grams per wheel on a AM 29er rig to get a sbustantially stonger wheelset? If you feel that AM edge 32H 2x is indestructible then how would 4x 36H behave? I am sure it will last for longer and stay true for years after 32H 3x needs trueing. </p>
<p>As long as Edge makes 32H 26er wheels I will not believe that 36H would be overkill. Larger wheel at the same hub flange spacing is always weaker than its smaller counterpart, thus why my wheels should be inferior to my buddy&#8217;s on a 26er?</p>
<p>Once that I own a 36H 4X wheelset I really believe in these particular numbers on 29er. How many of yous own 4x 36h wheelsets to chime in?</p>
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