Comments on: Sloping Top Tube Madness http://twentynineinches.com/2006/09/10/sloping-top-tube-madness/ 29er Bike Reviews, Rumors and News Mon, 13 Oct 2008 20:06:24 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6.2 By: justanotherbikegeek http://twentynineinches.com/2006/09/10/sloping-top-tube-madness/#comment-37433 justanotherbikegeek Thu, 03 Apr 2008 03:11:28 +0000 http://twentynineinches.com/2006/09/10/sloping-top-tube-madness/#comment-37433 Just came across this thread tonight, so I'm a bit late to the party. Anyway, I have a medium Raleigh xxix. I am 5 feet 9 inches tall on a good day (with bike shoes on). The stem is a 110mm Deda. And, yes, I had to get a longer post also. To get proper leg extension, the stock post was about 4mm above the minimum insertion line. Ted is 100% right in his assessment of the Raleigh needing a longer post. Personally, I like the aesthetics of the sloping top tube and I like the standover height. There ARE times when your wheels are sitting higher than where you're going to put your foot down and the extra standover height is a real nadsaver. Just came across this thread tonight, so I’m a bit late to the party. Anyway, I have a medium Raleigh xxix. I am 5 feet 9 inches tall on a good day (with bike shoes on). The stem is a 110mm Deda. And, yes, I had to get a longer post also. To get proper leg extension, the stock post was about 4mm above the minimum insertion line. Ted is 100% right in his assessment of the Raleigh needing a longer post. Personally, I like the aesthetics of the sloping top tube and I like the standover height. There ARE times when your wheels are sitting higher than where you’re going to put your foot down and the extra standover height is a real nadsaver.

]]> By: Guitar Ted http://twentynineinches.com/2006/09/10/sloping-top-tube-madness/#comment-17731 Guitar Ted Tue, 03 Jul 2007 02:49:15 +0000 http://twentynineinches.com/2006/09/10/sloping-top-tube-madness/#comment-17731 oderus: Nice triple post there! :) Anyway, if you would have carefully read through the comments, you would have seen where I did indeed look at all the frame measurements before "pulling the trigger". Also, you would have read that my main beef is with the spec on the seatpost, if the design is going to be that way. Subsequently to this posting, Raleigh made a change to 400mm seat posts for their '08 XXIX and XXIX+G. As far as being "simple", well it's anything but, as is usual in the real world. I doubt that I'm the only feller out there with this sort of beef, and I'm sure there are others out there like you too. Cool! To your point: the size range that Raleigh could fit would have been wider had they allowed for a 400mm post, right? Well, it would appear that at least they agreed with me, since, as you have read, they changed the spec. Cheers! Have a graet summer! oderus: Nice triple post there! :) Anyway, if you would have carefully read through the comments, you would have seen where I did indeed look at all the frame measurements before “pulling the trigger”. Also, you would have read that my main beef is with the spec on the seatpost, if the design is going to be that way. Subsequently to this posting, Raleigh made a change to 400mm seat posts for their ‘08 XXIX and XXIX+G.

As far as being “simple”, well it’s anything but, as is usual in the real world. I doubt that I’m the only feller out there with this sort of beef, and I’m sure there are others out there like you too. Cool! To your point: the size range that Raleigh could fit would have been wider had they allowed for a 400mm post, right? Well, it would appear that at least they agreed with me, since, as you have read, they changed the spec.

Cheers! Have a graet summer!

]]> By: Oderus http://twentynineinches.com/2006/09/10/sloping-top-tube-madness/#comment-17728 Oderus Tue, 03 Jul 2007 01:28:35 +0000 http://twentynineinches.com/2006/09/10/sloping-top-tube-madness/#comment-17728 This whole thing sounds pretty simple to me. You shouldn't have bought a Raleigh and what you should have done ws looked at all of the frame measurements before "pulling the trigger" Raleigh built a bike to fit a range of people. If you don't fit that range, look elsewhere. I am 6'2". There are bikes that fit me and bikes that don't. I ride what fits me. Simple. Next time, aim before you pull the trigger. This whole thing sounds pretty simple to me. You shouldn’t have bought a Raleigh and what you should have done ws looked at all of the frame measurements before “pulling the trigger” Raleigh built a bike to fit a range of people. If you don’t fit that range, look elsewhere. I am 6′2″. There are bikes that fit me and bikes that don’t. I ride what fits me. Simple. Next time, aim before you pull the trigger.

]]> By: Oderus http://twentynineinches.com/2006/09/10/sloping-top-tube-madness/#comment-17727 Oderus Tue, 03 Jul 2007 01:28:02 +0000 http://twentynineinches.com/2006/09/10/sloping-top-tube-madness/#comment-17727 This whole thing sounds pretty simple to me. You shouldn't have bought a Raleigh and what you should have done looked at all of the frame measurements before "pulling the trigger" Raleigh buily a bike to fit a range of people. If you don't fit that range, look elsewhere. I am 6'2". Their are bikes that fit me and bikes that don't. I ride what fits me. Simple. Next time, aim before you pull the trigger. This whole thing sounds pretty simple to me. You shouldn’t have bought a Raleigh and what you should have done looked at all of the frame measurements before “pulling the trigger” Raleigh buily a bike to fit a range of people. If you don’t fit that range, look elsewhere. I am 6′2″. Their are bikes that fit me and bikes that don’t. I ride what fits me. Simple. Next time, aim before you pull the trigger.

]]> By: Oderus http://twentynineinches.com/2006/09/10/sloping-top-tube-madness/#comment-17726 Oderus Tue, 03 Jul 2007 01:27:37 +0000 http://twentynineinches.com/2006/09/10/sloping-top-tube-madness/#comment-17726 This whole thing sounds pretty simple to me. You shouldn't have bought a Raleigh and should have done looked at all of the frame measurements before "pulling the trigger" Raleigh buily a bike to fit a range of people. If you don't fit that range, look elsewhere. I am 6'2". Their are bikes that fit me and bikes that don't. I ride what fits me. Simple. Next time, aim before you pull the trigger. This whole thing sounds pretty simple to me. You shouldn’t have bought a Raleigh and should have done looked at all of the frame measurements before “pulling the trigger” Raleigh buily a bike to fit a range of people. If you don’t fit that range, look elsewhere. I am 6′2″. Their are bikes that fit me and bikes that don’t. I ride what fits me. Simple. Next time, aim before you pull the trigger.

]]> By: poser adam http://twentynineinches.com/2006/09/10/sloping-top-tube-madness/#comment-3595 poser adam Mon, 18 Sep 2006 18:53:59 +0000 http://twentynineinches.com/2006/09/10/sloping-top-tube-madness/#comment-3595 OT: ekoostick, did you ever play SubSpace? back OT: at 6'2", I am thoroughly tickled that my XL Astrix Monk - with quoted 33" standover and 25.4" TT - fits me perfectly. Felt like I was taking a gamble ordering it sight unseen, but it's amazing. Looks like a real bike, too, not some dramatically-sloping weirdness. for what it's worth. OT: ekoostick, did you ever play SubSpace?

back OT: at 6′2″, I am thoroughly tickled that my XL Astrix Monk - with quoted 33″ standover and 25.4″ TT - fits me perfectly. Felt like I was taking a gamble ordering it sight unseen, but it’s amazing. Looks like a real bike, too, not some dramatically-sloping weirdness.

for what it’s worth.

]]> By: Guitar Ted http://twentynineinches.com/2006/09/10/sloping-top-tube-madness/#comment-3556 Guitar Ted Sat, 16 Sep 2006 10:18:00 +0000 http://twentynineinches.com/2006/09/10/sloping-top-tube-madness/#comment-3556 harold: Wow! Sorry that's what it sounds like to you, but you couldn't be more wrong. I understand and agree about the custom bike thing. One day, I will have one done up for me. Too many assumptions on your part have led to erroneous conclusions. My cockpit length is a number which I have honed in on over eighteen years of riding off road. It's a number that is the same on all of my bikes meant for off roading. Prone to catapulting myself over the bars? I've done it once since going to 29"ers in '03, and that was due to getting my front tire stuck in a sand pit, not by having my posistion screwed up, as you have implied. Your crass assumptions about the manufacturers of my bicycles bears no resemblence to reality and is unworthy of further comment. And by the way, I do not live "way out in the sticks" and I work at a professional bicycle dealer. Love and cherish a mere bicycle? I love and cherish something far more worthy. Finally, I don't think my bicycles are "crappy". I'm discussing a design feature that I think is a bit misguided and being handled poorly. Hopefully this discussion can stay on target here and not devolve into silly assumptions and off topic rantings. Thanks to those that have commented, I've enjoyed the discussion. harold: Wow! Sorry that’s what it sounds like to you, but you couldn’t be more wrong. I understand and agree about the custom bike thing. One day, I will have one done up for me.

Too many assumptions on your part have led to erroneous conclusions. My cockpit length is a number which I have honed in on over eighteen years of riding off road. It’s a number that is the same on all of my bikes meant for off roading. Prone to catapulting myself over the bars? I’ve done it once since going to 29″ers in ‘03, and that was due to getting my front tire stuck in a sand pit, not by having my posistion screwed up, as you have implied.

Your crass assumptions about the manufacturers of my bicycles bears no resemblence to reality and is unworthy of further comment.

And by the way, I do not live “way out in the sticks” and I work at a professional bicycle dealer. Love and cherish a mere bicycle? I love and cherish something far more worthy. Finally, I don’t think my bicycles are “crappy”. I’m discussing a design feature that I think is a bit misguided and being handled poorly.

Hopefully this discussion can stay on target here and not devolve into silly assumptions and off topic rantings.

Thanks to those that have commented, I’ve enjoyed the discussion.

]]> By: harold http://twentynineinches.com/2006/09/10/sloping-top-tube-madness/#comment-3554 harold Sat, 16 Sep 2006 03:00:49 +0000 http://twentynineinches.com/2006/09/10/sloping-top-tube-madness/#comment-3554 I think what BUCKY meant was things like seat tube angle which has a serious affect on the overall cockpit length. By the time you've raised your seat to be three inches over the bars you've changed that measurement a lot. You're also prone to catapult yourself otb, like you said before "when i crash i usually become airbourne". It sounds like you've made a habbit of buying more than one entry level bike sight unseen without human consultation. Let's say you buy a km, an on one, and an XXVIX something or other. What's that add up to, maybe $1500 if they were framesets? In the end you've shuffled a lot of parts around and attempted to adapt to three different beginner setups. You spent a bunch of imaginary cash online and overseas to a place where it's okay to pay nine year olds pennies a day and spill their filth into the air and water. Clearly none of the bikes suited you and you're still in the hunt for a new bike. Unless you live way out in the sticks it's not real hard to find a shop that carries custom bicycles that would be right for you from the start. You can pay somebody a fair price to fit you for a custom american made bicycle if you need custom in the first place. You're likely to love and cherish that bicycle for a long time and spend that time riding it instead of complaining about how crappy your cheap bike is on the internet. I think what BUCKY meant was things like seat tube angle which has a serious affect on the overall cockpit length. By the time you’ve raised your seat to be three inches over the bars you’ve changed that measurement a lot. You’re also prone to catapult yourself otb, like you said before “when i crash i usually become airbourne”.

It sounds like you’ve made a habbit of buying more than one entry level bike sight unseen without human consultation. Let’s say you buy a km, an on one, and an XXVIX something or other. What’s that add up to, maybe $1500 if they were framesets? In the end you’ve shuffled a lot of parts around and attempted to adapt to three different beginner setups. You spent a bunch of imaginary cash online and overseas to a place where it’s okay to pay nine year olds pennies a day and spill their filth into the air and water. Clearly none of the bikes suited you and you’re still in the hunt for a new bike.

Unless you live way out in the sticks it’s not real hard to find a shop that carries custom bicycles that would be right for you from the start. You can pay somebody a fair price to fit you for a custom american made bicycle if you need custom in the first place. You’re likely to love and cherish that bicycle for a long time and spend that time riding it instead of complaining about how crappy your cheap bike is on the internet.

]]> By: Guitar Ted http://twentynineinches.com/2006/09/10/sloping-top-tube-madness/#comment-3550 Guitar Ted Fri, 15 Sep 2006 17:21:54 +0000 http://twentynineinches.com/2006/09/10/sloping-top-tube-madness/#comment-3550 BUCKY: Nice, but top tube measurement is not a measurement that you should compromise in bike fit. Also, "normally" a bike with a top tube measurement of 23.5" or above doesn't have a 16" or less seat tube. You see? It doesn't have a thing to do with a "standover" measurement, which is a nebulous measurement, at best. It's about what you as a bike company spec for the ability to size people properly. In the case of the XXIX, the seat post is too short, or Raleigh could re-design the bike with a more appropriately sized seat tube for the top tube spec. I have a spec sheet on the XXIX that was sent to me in June that does not list standover , just so you know. BUCKY: Nice, but top tube measurement is not a measurement that you should compromise in bike fit. Also, “normally” a bike with a top tube measurement of 23.5″ or above doesn’t have a 16″ or less seat tube. You see? It doesn’t have a thing to do with a “standover” measurement, which is a nebulous measurement, at best. It’s about what you as a bike company spec for the ability to size people properly. In the case of the XXIX, the seat post is too short, or Raleigh could re-design the bike with a more appropriately sized seat tube for the top tube spec.

I have a spec sheet on the XXIX that was sent to me in June that does not list standover , just so you know.

]]> By: BUCKY http://twentynineinches.com/2006/09/10/sloping-top-tube-madness/#comment-3548 BUCKY Fri, 15 Sep 2006 17:06:20 +0000 http://twentynineinches.com/2006/09/10/sloping-top-tube-madness/#comment-3548 BACK TO TT VS STAND OVER. YOU NEED TO READ ALL THE SPECS BEFORE YOU BUY NOT JUST TT. IF IT WON'T WORK FOR YOU DON'T BUY IT. CONSIDER A CUSTOM BIKE WITH REAL CUSTOMIZATIONS. THERE IS SO MUCH MORE TO SIZING A BIKE THAN THOSE TWO MEASUREMENTS. BACK TO TT VS STAND OVER. YOU NEED TO READ ALL THE SPECS BEFORE YOU BUY NOT JUST TT. IF IT WON’T WORK FOR YOU DON’T BUY IT. CONSIDER A CUSTOM BIKE WITH REAL CUSTOMIZATIONS.
THERE IS SO MUCH MORE TO SIZING A BIKE THAN THOSE TWO MEASUREMENTS.

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